the Fresh Prince of Wells Fargo: a 76ers Chronicle

Re: the Fresh Prince of Wells Fargo: a 76ers Chronicle

Postby Gimpy » Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:35 pm

The NBA is defined by dynastic teams and larger than life players. Ratings are at their best when there are a few incredible teams.
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Re: the Fresh Prince of Wells Fargo: a 76ers Chronicle

Postby Eddie Jordan » Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:41 pm

If Embiid is awesome none of this will really matter
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Re: the Fresh Prince of Wells Fargo: a 76ers Chronicle

Postby MoBettle » Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:43 pm

Shadow wrote:
Youseff wrote:Ish Smith, the guy that had been on 8 NBA teams before the Sixers, got discovered by Sam Hinkie.


I didn't say he discovered him, but you have to give Hinkie credit for signing him when no one else did, don't you? I'm not saying he deserves some award, but it's hardly a negative on his resume of GM moves.

I think he's done a pretty good job, if you look at what his goal was. If his goal was to have a 40 win team by year 3, then sure, he failed, but I don't think he was planning anything of the sort. I don't think Hinkie can be fully judged until this all plays itself out, though. And now with Colangelo on board, that makes it even more difficult. We'll always be asking ourselves who was the man behind the moves.


Well technically he was cut and the Sixers claimed him off waivers, so basically only the Knicks and Twolves passed on him.

It was a fine move, IDK if it's really that big of a feather in his cap given he wasn't really considered a long term piece by a team that thinks exclusively in terms of long term pieces. For a while they were starting Canaan over him because of that.
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Re: the Fresh Prince of Wells Fargo: a 76ers Chronicle

Postby Napalm » Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:44 pm

it's December, year 3 of the tank. Sixers brought in Jerry Colangelo today and we sittin' here talkin bout Ish Smith man.
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Re: the Fresh Prince of Wells Fargo: a 76ers Chronicle

Postby Youseff » Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:44 pm

Shadow wrote:
Youseff wrote:Ish Smith, the guy that had been on 8 NBA teams before the Sixers, got discovered by Sam Hinkie.


I didn't say he discovered him, but you have to give Hinkie credit for signing him when no one else did, don't you? I'm not saying he deserves some award, but it's hardly a negative on his resume of GM moves.

I think he's done a pretty good job, if you look at what his goal was. If his goal was to have a 40 win team by year 3, then sure, he failed, but I don't think he was planning anything of the sort. I don't think Hinkie can be fully judged until this all plays itself out, though. And now with Colangelo on board, that makes it even more difficult. We'll always be asking ourselves who was the man behind the moves.


disagree with most of this. I think it's fair to judge Hinkie on the constant negative press that this team has. I think it's fair to judge the GM with the most negative press in the modern era.

In regards to the bolded - I guess - who cares, though? Hinkie has some very clear strengths and outside of the Sixers twitter bubble, it's very clear he has negatives. If Colangelo can be a mentor, can provide a counterbalance to some of Hinkie's weaknesses, and they can take it to the next level, I see it as a net positive. I'm always going to be a bigger fan of the team than the GM.
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Re: the Fresh Prince of Wells Fargo: a 76ers Chronicle

Postby MoBettle » Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:45 pm

Yeah who gives a crap who the man behind the moves. We're Sizzlers fans not Hinkie fans guys.
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Re: the Fresh Prince of Wells Fargo: a 76ers Chronicle

Postby Youseff » Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:47 pm

Napalm wrote:it's December, year 3 of the tank. Sixers brought in Jerry Colangelo today and we sittin' here talkin bout Ish Smith man.


if he's the second guy you reference when discussing the Hink's scouting prowess then I dunno, man...


anyway, this is another reason I like this signing. Hinkie creates so much negative attention, even amongst people who know what they're talking about, who aren't idiots like the Sonic the Hedgehog guy says. Hinkie can still do his smart #$!&@ behind the scenes, and not be as much of a lighting rod to draw negative attention.
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Re: the Fresh Prince of Wells Fargo: a 76ers Chronicle

Postby Youseff » Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:49 pm

only way I see this is bad is if the Silver thing is true.
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Re: the Fresh Prince of Wells Fargo: a 76ers Chronicle

Postby PSUEagle » Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:50 pm

Not a direct criticism of anyone in this thread, but why is the current (past?) 76ers plan so radical? Haven't the Houston Astros been doing the exact same thing for the last few years?

I don't follow baseball all that closely, but didn't they have some bad luck/bad picks among their trio of 1/1's? Yet they've done some stuff that's arguably more unscrupulous than anything Hinkie's done like intentionally low balling a #1 pick so they could get the #2 compensatory pick the next year in a draft they deemed stronger. And now they're sitting on tons of young talent with money to burn to augment that core. Hmm, sounds familiar...

#$!&@, I want my GM to be cold hearted and ruthless and look for every single edge he can find. Hence I'm most definitely a Hinkie apologist.
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Re: the Fresh Prince of Wells Fargo: a 76ers Chronicle

Postby Gimpy » Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:50 pm

I don't know if you can really tout the Smith signing considering that we didn't bring him back and it's not like we were outbid for him.
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Re: the Fresh Prince of Wells Fargo: a 76ers Chronicle

Postby Shadow » Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:51 pm

Youseff wrote:
Shadow wrote:
Youseff wrote:Ish Smith, the guy that had been on 8 NBA teams before the Sixers, got discovered by Sam Hinkie.


I didn't say he discovered him, but you have to give Hinkie credit for signing him when no one else did, don't you? I'm not saying he deserves some award, but it's hardly a negative on his resume of GM moves.

I think he's done a pretty good job, if you look at what his goal was. If his goal was to have a 40 win team by year 3, then sure, he failed, but I don't think he was planning anything of the sort. I don't think Hinkie can be fully judged until this all plays itself out, though. And now with Colangelo on board, that makes it even more difficult. We'll always be asking ourselves who was the man behind the moves.


disagree with most of this. I think it's fair to judge Hinkie on the constant negative press that this team has. I think it's fair to judge the GM with the most negative press in the modern era.

In regards to the bolded - I guess - who cares, though? Hinkie has some very clear strengths and outside of the Sixers twitter bubble, it's very clear he has negatives. If Colangelo can be a mentor, can provide a counterbalance to some of Hinkie's weaknesses, and they can take it to the next level, I see it as a net positive. I'm always going to be a bigger fan of the team than the GM.


Negative press doesn't mean it is warranted. I think most of the negative press is asinine and moronic, and created by people who just want to make waves and get people to talk about them. I've heard outlandish things like the NBA should force Joshua Harris to sell the team, because of what Hinkie has done. Riiiight... put him in the same category is racist Donald Sterling. Let's not allow the owner of his team and his GM to build the team they way they see fit. That's dictator esque. The negative press is mostly blasphemous, and a lot of it is borderline slanderous and unprofessional. So I don't even give that any credence.

I don't even know if I've seen enough of Hinkie to really say definitively what his strength's and weaknesses are yet. I'll have to wait until his final team is constructed and base it off of that. Right now he's still searching for pieces to build the ship, but you need to see the ship run to see if those pieces were the right ones.

If Colangelo is merely a mentor, then sure. I have my doubts though. Call me a cynic, but I just have a bad feeling. I guess we'll find out in due time if that proves to be warranted or not.
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Re: the Fresh Prince of Wells Fargo: a 76ers Chronicle

Postby Napalm » Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:53 pm

Youseff wrote:only way I see this is bad is if the Silver thing is true.

if we're talking in hypothetics, my guess is he got involved after the Okafor incident. The team said it would take care of the matter in house, but didn't display to have any kind of protocol in place to handle these situations in the future. Silver seems to understand and accept the point of the plan, but also sees a front office not yet prepared to allow the players to fully grow. That's when Adam gave Josh a number to call. A fixer upper meant to whip this agenda into shape.
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Re: the Fresh Prince of Wells Fargo: a 76ers Chronicle

Postby Youseff » Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:54 pm

you said the negative press is "blasphemous," my Sega Genesis friend.
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Re: the Fresh Prince of Wells Fargo: a 76ers Chronicle

Postby Napalm » Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:55 pm

Gimpy wrote:I don't know if you can really tout the Smith signing considering that we didn't bring him back and it's not like we were outbid for him.

This made me think of Thomas Robinson for a moment. I certainly credit Hinkie with that.
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Re: the Fresh Prince of Wells Fargo: a 76ers Chronicle

Postby Gimpy » Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:55 pm

At its core, the Sixers plan is to win championships. The first step, which I think is the right move, is to find a great player. I love that they're aggressively pursuing it.

The radical part is that they totally don't care about other stuff right now. Sure, they're working their asses off to develop players, but everything that's being done is to get as many bullets in the chamber and hope they can hit a bullseye eventually. The complete disregard for short-term "success" (which I'm putting in quotes because the Sixers don't measure success by wins and losses right now) is what's so crazy to everyone else.

I don't totally agree with the critics, but I see where they're coming from. It bothers me when people who don't watch the Sixers at all complain about it, but I think it's very fair for fans (like Youseff) to get ornery about slogging through awful basketball as part of the plan.
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Re: the Fresh Prince of Wells Fargo: a 76ers Chronicle

Postby Gimpy » Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:57 pm

Napalm wrote:
Gimpy wrote:I don't know if you can really tout the Smith signing considering that we didn't bring him back and it's not like we were outbid for him.

This made me think of Thomas Robinson for a moment. I certainly credit Hinkie with that.


I credit him with taking a shot on an undervalued guy, but I wouldn't call that scouting genius or anything.
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Re: the Fresh Prince of Wells Fargo: a 76ers Chronicle

Postby Napalm » Mon Dec 07, 2015 11:03 pm

Gimpy wrote:
Napalm wrote:
Gimpy wrote:I don't know if you can really tout the Smith signing considering that we didn't bring him back and it's not like we were outbid for him.

This made me think of Thomas Robinson for a moment. I certainly credit Hinkie with that.


I credit him with taking a shot on an undervalued guy, but I wouldn't call that scouting genius or anything.

yea I think i may credit Brett Brown more with him than Hinkie. The thing about Hinkie the evaluator is that he has worked within the confines of undervalued finds. Guys like Royce White or Christian Wood, Jakarr. Tony Wroten was a great get. KJ and Grant were good picks. He's hit on the high picks, although it's too early to grade them. He's shed the trash and constructed quite a bit without baggage. Admirable effort.
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Re: the Fresh Prince of Wells Fargo: a 76ers Chronicle

Postby Shadow » Tue Dec 08, 2015 6:40 am

I slept on it, and a new theory on why Joshua Harris decided to make this move now.

Harris is a hedge fund guy. In that world, it's all about being right. It's very bottom line. It makes me wonder if this all started right before the 2014 draft. Hinkie, when meeting with Harris and Brown probably told them they were going to get Wiggins(like everyone thought at the time with Cleveland falling in love with Embiid and Brown admitted after the draft they thought they were going to get him) and everything was looking glorious. Then Embiid breaks his foot. Not Hinkie's fault, but still... Harris is probably a bottom line guy. Now, Hinkie in Harris' eyes looks wrong. They have to settle on Embiid, the guy with the broken foot, who has a setback, had rumors of being childish and not taking rehab seriously... possibly making the pick look even worse in Harris' eyes. Then, obviously the Saric move.

Then 2015 comes along. Hinkie is telling Harris and Brown that the Sixers are going to have their PG of the future in Russell. The Sixers have their big men, they will fix PG, and things are about to start looking up. The Lakers pull a bit of a stunner and take Russell. As per Woj during the draft, the Sixers while on the clock were trying to decide on who to take up until the last minute, which tells me they didn't really expect that to happen. Another hit in Harris' eyes of Hinkie. Two draft, two things not going the way his trusted basketball man thought they would. Again, not his fault, but Harris is probably very much a bottom line guy.

Then, their pick turns out to have off the court issues. Coincidentally, this is when Colangelo is brought in. Harris says enough is enough, I paid you to be right, we thought we were going to have Wiggins and Russell, and not only were you wrong, but the guys you picked in their place now both have major issues. I'm bringing in another voice. I realize this is all completely theoretical, and I could be completely off base about all of it, overthinking it, but anyway... just a theory. Now off to work.
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Re: the Fresh Prince of Wells Fargo: a 76ers Chronicle

Postby Grotewold » Tue Dec 08, 2015 7:17 am

I think that's right and that it sucks, what was Cifaretto gonna do differently
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Re: the Fresh Prince of Wells Fargo: a 76ers Chronicle

Postby heyeaglefn » Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:24 am

Hinkie doesn't seem like the type to guarantee something is going to happen to his boss.
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