Jimmy Rollins is having an historic season

Postby Drugs Delaney » Thu Aug 30, 2007 9:54 pm

milton bernard thompson wrote:did you mean no shortstop has surpassed this in the history of the phillies rather than in the history of the game? i must be missing something, because i think a-rod had a few 50 HR seasons at SS didn't he. rollins is a great player, but him dominating phillies shortstops of yesteryear statistically is wholly unimpressive and assumed to be the case as far as i'm concerned. it's a different position today than it was up until the 80s, they bother to put offense there rather than picking $#@! hitters who are kind of wiry and fast for some ungodly reason.

Read my post again a little more closely. No single player in the history of the game has put up numbers that exceed the ones Rollins has already put up this season before September. There's no qualifier in this. Not just Phillies or shortstops. It's every single player ever. None have done what Jimmy has done.

Sure, it's arbitrary and I'm not saying he's even the best player on his team, but the season he's had thus far is truly remarkable.
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Postby Disco Stu » Thu Aug 30, 2007 9:55 pm

Drugs Delaney wrote:
milton bernard thompson wrote:did you mean no shortstop has surpassed this in the history of the phillies rather than in the history of the game? i must be missing something, because i think a-rod had a few 50 HR seasons at SS didn't he. rollins is a great player, but him dominating phillies shortstops of yesteryear statistically is wholly unimpressive and assumed to be the case as far as i'm concerned. it's a different position today than it was up until the 80s, they bother to put offense there rather than picking $#@! hitters who are kind of wiry and fast for some ungodly reason.

Read my post again a little more closely. No single player in the history of the game has put up numbers that exceed the ones Rollins has already put up this season before September. There's no qualifier in this. Not just Phillies or shortstops. It's every single player ever. None have done what Jimmy has done.

Sure, it's arbitrary and I'm not saying he's even the best player on his team, but the season he's had thus far is truly remarkable.


I think he has had the most PAs in the history of the game before September.
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Postby Drugs Delaney » Fri Aug 31, 2007 1:48 am

Disco Stu wrote:I think he has had the most PAs in the history of the game before September.

That's quite likely true. Of course, this is no fault of Jimmy Rollins'. Things like that will happen for the guy who bats leadoff and doesn't miss a game for a high scoring team.
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Postby philliesphhan » Fri Aug 31, 2007 2:47 am

Disco Stu wrote:
I think he has had the most PAs in the history of the game before September.


Lenny Dykstra had almost the same in 1993. In fact, Rollins is on pace to have about 2 less for the year.
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Postby Disco Stu » Fri Aug 31, 2007 6:11 am

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Postby TenuredVulture » Fri Aug 31, 2007 9:31 am

I don't want to get into intangibles v. numbers blah blah blah. I just want to say that Jimmy Rollins does some things very well--he's an outstanding baserunner, not just fast but smart. (Smart is the intangible, but I think it shows up in not getting caught stealing, etc.)

Second, there's always been the question concerning whether he's suited to leadoff--ideally, you'd like him to walk more. However, the fact that he hits a good number of extra base hits in some ways compensates for not walking. And, of course, he doesn't lead off every inning either.
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Postby Uncle Milty » Fri Aug 31, 2007 9:41 am

Stuey, just finally admit you were wrong about Rollins and his contract.
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Postby CFP » Fri Aug 31, 2007 9:43 am

I don't understand the amount of articles Conlin has written on J-Roll this season. It's almost like he does it on purpose to rub it in the face of us people trying to say that a guy can actually have a good season without a good OBP. Whatever Bill.
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Postby Disco Stu » Fri Aug 31, 2007 9:44 am

Uncle Milty wrote:Stuey, just finally admit you were wrong about Rollins and his contract.


I have said that he has played up to his contract. At the time he was being paid more than he should. But he has played a LOT better than he was then and salaries have skyrocketed. Does Wade get credit for this?
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Postby Drugs Delaney » Sun Sep 02, 2007 11:24 am

Jimmy's had seven consecutive multi-hit games. His OBP is up to .350. He's leading all of Major League Baseball in total bases. He also leads the Majors in outs (tied with Mr. Pierre). Has anyone ever led MLB in both categories before?

Denny Hocking was on Fox Sports Radio yesterday and he called Jimmy his NL MVP because he's been the one constant that has held the team together through all of the injuries.

I think if Jimmy ends up with a line like .300 BA, 30 HR, 30 SB, 140 R, 95 RBI and leads the league in extra-base hits and total bases, he's going to garner serious MVP consideration.
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Postby Drugs Delaney » Sun Sep 02, 2007 12:33 pm

Jimmy Rollins' numbers in the last 365 days:

Code: Select all
PA  AB  R   H  2B 3B HR RBI  BB IBB  SO HBP  SH  SF  ROE GDP SB CS   BA    OBP   SLG   OPS
789 723 138 212 42 19 31 102  50   6  85   7   0   9   7  11  33  6  .293  .341  .533  .873

92 extra-base hits! That's insane for a leadoff hitter.
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Postby pacino » Sun Sep 02, 2007 12:37 pm

he's not even the best SS in the division, and his EQA isn't even above .290. Utley, Burrell and Howard are all higher
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Postby swishnicholson » Sun Sep 02, 2007 1:17 pm

Years ago they used to love those "field general" types for MVP, those catchers ands shortstops who were always keeping other players aware of the situation, spurring them on at tense times and fielding their important positions well. Gradually (and thankfully) the voting for this award has gotten away from this and instead rewarded those who clearly contributed to more tangible goals, such as scoring more runs than the other team, although there remains an inexplicable (to me) attachment to players who participated with winning teams, even though it's an individual award. And "leadership" or other intangibles still play a part. I can remember being incredulous when when Stargell won the co-mvp despite underwhelming statistics.

But I'm not sure the needle hasn't drifted too far in the other direction, with the top MVP candidates simply being the top OPS producers . Shortstop and catcher do merit extra consideration and defensive prowess should certainly be a consideration (and I'm not certain that when you take this into consideration that Ramirez is necessarily superior to Rollins, although I'd certainly take him in a trade straight up). And I do think the role the player plays in the team dynamic should also be considered. I like Burrell, but I consider Rollins to be a more irreplaceable player whatever their EQA's, and in some ways , although not overall, more irreplaceable than Howard or Utley.

All this is a long-winded way of saying that while Rollins would not be my choice for MVP, if he should have a ridiculous September I wouldn't consider it a travesty in any way, shape or form.

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Postby Drugs Delaney » Sun Sep 02, 2007 1:29 pm

pacino wrote:he's not even the best SS in the division, and his EQA isn't even above .290. Utley, Burrell and Howard are all higher

He's clearly having a better season than Reyes or Renteria and I think his defensive edge over Ramirez gives him an argument that he might be the best all-around shortstop in the division this year.

As for his EQA and its comparison to Utley, Burrell and Howard, it doesn't matter. They're all having good seasons. It's just that for the type of player that Rollins is, he's having a truly outstanding season.
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Postby phatj » Sun Sep 09, 2007 9:53 am

THis isn't really historic, but an interesting tidbit about Rollins, courtesy of Baseball Musings.

Rollins is fourth in the majors in Runs Scored plus Runs Batted In, and is the only leadoff hitter in the top ten.
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Postby Drugs Delaney » Sat Sep 15, 2007 4:19 pm

I know it's not likely yet, but if the Phillies make the playoffs, I think you have to call Jimmy Rollins the NL MVP.

Side note: If that blown call from the other night costs Jimmy his 20-20-20-20 season, I'm gonna be pissed.
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Postby Disco Stu » Sat Sep 15, 2007 4:25 pm

Drugs Delaney wrote:I know it's not likely yet, but if the Phillies make the playoffs, I think you have to call Jimmy Rollins the NL MVP.

Side note: If that blown call from the other night costs Jimmy his 20-20-20-20 season, I'm gonna be pissed.


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Postby Drugs Delaney » Fri Sep 21, 2007 1:29 am

Tonight Jimmy broke Ernie Banks' long-standing National League record for extra-base hits in a season by a shortstop when his second double of the game gave him 84 extra-base hits on the season. Banks had 83 in 1957.
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Postby phorever » Fri Sep 21, 2007 4:09 am

Drugs Delaney wrote:Tonight Jimmy broke Ernie Banks' long-standing National League record for extra-base hits in a season by a shortstop when his second double of the game gave him 84 extra-base hits on the season. Banks had 83 in 1957.


even with the ton of pa's jimmy gets, that's pretty impressive.
scaling sandberg's best year up to jimmy's pa's still leaves the former at 82.
by the way, i somehow missed sandberg becoming jimmy's #1 comp the last couple of seasons. he might be able to add a couple more hof's to his top ten comp list after this season. what a year.
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Postby Goomeister » Fri Sep 21, 2007 4:43 am

Drugs Delaney wrote:I know it's not likely yet, but if the Phillies make the playoffs, I think you have to call Jimmy Rollins the NL MVP.

Side note: If that blown call from the other night costs Jimmy his 20-20-20-20 season, I'm gonna be pissed.


If the Brewers win the Central, I think Prince Fielder is the MVP. If the Brewers don't win the Cetnral and both the Phillies and Mets make the playoffs, I think Jimmy wins over David Wright.
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